Monday, April 2, 2007

What it takes to have faith?

Skepticism refers to the act of intellectual caution before accepting a claim. To constantly view a claim as being doubtful until it has been proven otherwise.

We are all fond of turning down logic and skepticism as being man-made tools and thus being necessarily flawed. However I fail to see, how then, any person can use her reasoning to succesfully embrace a faith.

It surprises me to hear theists accept that faith cannot be proven via logic or reasoning and yet they are convinced that they are on the right path. Here lies the biggest paradox. All the theists, that are spiritually satisfied, are convinced that their's is the right religion.

Here is an interesting fact: All major organized religions (Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism) require its followers to have faith in God. All the various gods are invisible. They can be "felt" and not seen. The point is.........the first thing gods want to do is to test their believers whether or not they have faith in the unseen (the invisible and unprovable gods).

What does it take to have faith in only one religion then?? Why doesn't the "theist" start having faith in every single non-provable non-falsifiable theory out there?? Surely if many people believe in it.......it must exist?

Tomorrow we can start believing in the Flying Spaghetti Monster because no one can disprove it exists right?

6 comments:

Noor Pamiri said...

Proving the existance of a supreme being is not that hard, I would say.

It depends highly on personal human experiences. Some may find their God in a the stone some would find it in the fire some would find in something else. That all people should follow a specific religion, that is unversal, is against the basics of human intellect. At no time in history have people believed in a common concept, not necessarily linked to faith. Religion depends on the environmental, cultural and economic aspirations, capabiliities of its followers. And it can be seen that religions that have accepted pluralism have been able to grow more rapidly.

The Islamic architecture is an example of Islam's openness to experimentation, absorptoin of pluralist concepts and allowance of differentiation. Within Islam, as we all know, are more than six dozen sects, each interpreting the teachings of Quran in its own way!!

Saying that one of these sects or any other religion is WRONG is highly difficult because:

All major religions are divine.
All prophets and the four divine scriptures have a commonality that connects all faiths at a single knot.

It is not difficult to see that 124,000 messengers did not come at one time. The difference in their period of arrival, in my point of view, and the technological/cultural transitions in their respective socieites is responsible for the different religions that exist today.

Faith needs not to be proved like 2+2=4. It is impossible. Faith, the divine being and their interrelationships can only be understood at different levels of spiritual attainment.

What is the God that all can understand and comprehend even inside their craddles!!

What is the faith that all can decipher!!

If comprehension of God was that easy there would have been many Gods on this earth as well!!

We, under the pull of divine gravition, tend to move towards comprehension of a being that can't be easily comprehended, otherwise. I am amazed at people, who despite of knowing the temporal nature of threir presence on earth, refute the fact that they don't have control over anyting in their lives, that they always fail when confronted with mother nature, an expression of the presence of the supreme being.

cynic_path said...

You said:It depends highly on personal human experiences.

I suggest: Something that depends on personal human experience cannot be termed as proof at all. Humans experience psychosis at times….humans experience hallucinations at times…..and additionally humans also experience collective spirituality as well. The reason for such bizarre behaviors are purely evolutionary and can be explained away by scientific study.


You said: That all people should follow a specific religion, that is unversal, is against the basics of human intellect

I reply: Correct me if I am wrong. As far as I know all the major religions claim to be the true religions. They bring the message of human salvation. Christianity claims that you have to heaven through the son Jesus Christ. Islam says that until you recite the Shahada and have faith in it…..you are destined for hellfire. How then do you claim that people shouldn’t or couldn’t for that matter follow a Universal Religion? Islam calls itself the Universal religion….doesn’t it??


You claim: All major religions are divine.

I say: That is your faith. I don’t believe any religion is divine until someone can prove to me they are.


Your last paragraph: Mother nature being an expression of the supreme being.

My conclusion: Big claim again....but no proof. I don't see mothernature as being anyhing supernatural. Everything in the Universe works under some laws of physics. Some we know...some we have mastered..some we will learn one day.

Every scientist knows the limitations of science and human nature. No person with a working brain should conclude that he has mastery over everything or knows everything. However, I fail to see how a person not knowing something automatically suggests that there is a supreme being that knows and controls everything.

Noor Pamiri said...

you said: I don’t believe any religion is divine until someone can prove to me they are.

That is the safest and most explicit Ostrich Game most athiest are used to play. How much do you know about Jumping Genes about electorns? Do you know about these objects as much as a sceintist would know? No. You don't. And still you believe in them. How many laws of physics do you completely understand? Do you know all the laws? No, I guess. Why still then do you belive in them?

Your would most probably say that because you believe that certain people have been able to prove them in a laboratory using LOGICAL reasoning.

What if I say that I believe in FAITH, even having agreed that I don't comprehend all the intricacies involved therein, just because I believe that many people have been able to "see", to "feel" to "communicate" with the "divine" in their own "laboratories".

I read a book written, just last night (not necessary to say that I m not prepared for MM hourly)written by Nasir Khusrow, an Ismaili preacher and philosopher of the 10th century. He writes that debating the "existance" or "absence" of GOD is illogical in itself becauce we can only prove with logic only those that are in the "circle of understanding". He, no doubt, means that the Supreme Being, logically, is some one who is not in the sphere of common human understanding. He belives, however, that it is not impossible to be "one" with the divine, that is to understand Him, if there is a "Faith" that is not "irrational".

cynic_path said...

Its not at all necessary for me to go and learn all the laws of science to believe in them. As I have claimed so many times that Science is an open field. If you "doubt" it you can go and test for yourself. If you challenge it you can go and experiment yourself empirically.

Even though maybe I have not been able to learn all the laws of science.....I know that many people have. Bring me one scientist who disagrees with the scientific community on most topics and I Will stop believing in science.

In religion there is no agreement. And by agreement I ofcourse mean agreement about salvation. Each religion has a different path for salvation. So my friend please enlighten me as my basic question remains unanswered: Which many people's faith should I believe in if I don't feel god at all?? Is it my fault that he is hiding away from me the more I use reasoning and logic. What a great way of testing us humans who question him. He creates more hurdles for us then for those who want to praise him and love him blindly without questioning.

Noor Pamiri said...

Your Logic is not capable of understanding HIM. He can be understood not only with Logic, devotion, Love for him and not ouotright negation(despite of the visible inability to fathom even a grain of the truth!!!!!) are also needed to decipher his codes.

Closing your eyes to Love of God and still claiming that you hinderences are being created for you is a tragedy, to say the least.

cynic_path said...

You still didn't tell me which god should I love and be devoted to. Which god's love are we talking about??

Since logic only won't suffice here then I must learn about how to love something which I have no evidence whatsoever exists.

Should I also love the Tooth Fairy and the Santa Claus?? Many children who cannot prove with logic that they exist love both of these characters and believe in them.

If you find time then read up about the Invisible Pink Unicorn.